The Scottish War Graves Project

spoons

I was in Dornock cememetery today and noticed that a widow's name had been added later to a CWGC official gravestone. There is also an official CWGC gravestone in Annan that has had the soldier's mother and father's names added later. Does anyone one happen to know the policy on this and is it widespread?

\Paul

Adam Brown · Joined: 21 Sep 2007 Posts: 714 Location: Edinburgh

I don't think it's that widespread. Is it the case the inscripition counts as the one allowed at the bottom of the headstones. Perhaps they died just after the war?

Does it look like it has been inscribed later by a local stomemason? It may go back to the CWGC charter which covers UK markers differently to ones overseas and maybe there is more freedom for families to add inscriptions here?

Adam

apanderson · Joined: 02 Oct 2007 Posts: 6903 Location: Stirlingshire

Interesting point . . . .

. . . . . and I don't think one with a definitive answer!

I would imagine that if CWGC stones were in a line or a group, then any additions to stones would be 'official', however, in the case of stones scattered all over a cemetery I imagine that it's more likely to be the case that names could be added whether 'officially' done or not.

From personal experience, I've seen stones with all sorts of extras added, obviously always at the bottom

I suppose another aspect to consider is that these 'scattered' stones might actually be in lairs already owned by the family and they chose a CWGC stone rather than a family one at the time, so presumably if it's the only stone there, the families concerned saw no harm in adding futher names. I can't imagine that there's many checks done on these 'forgotten' stones as some of them are in an awful state and considering the size of some of the bigger cemeteries, nobody would notice anyway?

Anne

apanderson · Joined: 02 Oct 2007 Posts: 6903 Location: Stirlingshire

I was just reading a thread on CWG on this subject.

"The original is a Commonwealth War grave - a private grave with a CWGC headstone by request (the relatives could request a CWGC stone or elect to have a private one). A later death of a family member has occured and he has been buried in the same grave (could not happen if it was a CWGC owned grave).

In these circumstances the family have paid to have the later name added to the headstone. It happens sometimes where the grave is privately owned and CWGC permit it provided the NoK pay the cost."

The is a quote from Terry Denham (one of the Mods who I believe might have a connection of sorts to CWGC)

Anne

spoons · Posted: Wed Nov 14, 2007 10:56 pm Post subject:

That makes sense. In the first case I looked at, the soldier died in 1918 and the widow in 1921. In the second case, the soldier died in 1917, his father in 1916 and his mother in 192?

I can only presume that the soldier was buried in his father's grave and CWGC provided a stone using the permitted inscription area to add the fathers name. The mother being added a few years later. Certainly unusual but nice that they can all be on the same stone in the local tradition.

\Paul

apanderson · Joined: 02 Oct 2007 Posts: 6903 Location: Stirlingshire

In Camelon Cemetery (Section 11, Grave 189), there is a CWGC stone bearing the name of Sgt. Robert Tavendale, K.O.S.B., died 24th January 1918 age 34 and at the bottom of the same stone is Pte. John Hendry, A. & S. H., died 18th July 1924 age 44. Pte. Hendry isn't listed on CWGC - his date of death obviously being outwith the 'criteria'.

Anyway, as usual, my nose was bothering me. On Sgt. Tavendale's CWGC entry, he is listed as the husband of Jane Hendry Tavendale - mmmm ..... so, his wife's maiden name was Hendry. I went along to the Cemetery Records Office to do a wee bit of noseying and I discovered that not only were the above two men buried in that Lair, but Jane (Robert's wife) and their two sons were too.

I think John must have been Jane's wee brother as working out their dates of birth from the internment print-out, she was born in 1885 and he in 1880. So Lair 189 in Section 11, which incidentally, is also the section that the Cross of Sacrifice is in, turns out to be the resting place of the Tavendale Family, not only Robert. It's just a pity that there's no stone to Jane and their two sons, but as you said Paul, nice that they're together.

I've just started posting Camelon photos so it'll be a wee while before I get to 'T'. When I do, I'll add a wee note on my findings - at least that way, anyone searching for Sgt. Tavendale will get a wee bit more than just 'the usual'.

Anne

kinnethmont · Joined: 25 Mar 2008 Posts: 121 Location: aberdeenshire

In the UK many war graves (most) are not owned by CWGC but by the NoK. As such, CWGC has no rights - except that, if it has a CWGC headstone, the stone is their property and they can govern what appears on it.

In the home countries CWGC do permit the addition of a family member details where the Personal Inscription usually appears. This has to be arranged and funded by the NoK after permission is granted. It can happen at any time.

Remember, CWGC did not become involved with Home burials until 1920. by which time, many had been buried by NOK in the usual way. A considerable number of these were never made known to CWGC by the relatives. Where they were made aware a war stone was offered in their perpetual care, but often it was declined. CWGC have no interest in private family headstones.
_________________
Jim

If ye break faith with us who die
We shall not sleep, though poppies grow
In Flanders fields.